Welcome to the Water Rocket Forum, sponsored by The Water Rocket Achievement World Record Association.

Since our founding in 2003, we've become the largest, most sophisticated and ground breaking group supporting you, the serious water rocket flyer! Whether you are a beginner or an expert, the WRA2 has something for everyone.

A water rocket is a type of model rocket using water as its reaction mass. The pressure vessel (the engine of the rocket) is constructed from thin plastic or other non metallic materials (usually a used plastic soft drink bottle) weighing 1,500 grams or less. The water is forced out by compressed air. It is an example of Newton's third law of motion.

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Shalini from New Delhi, India,
Kevin Colvill from Hailey, Idaho, USA,
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Competition revisions

This forum is for non-members to ask questions about our competitions. Please check our FAQ page before you ask.

Should we replace the "WRA2 Altitude Challenge" with a new competition?

Poll ended at Tue Jan 01, 2013 1:00 pm

No, Leave it the same.
1
4%
Yes, replace it with an altitude competition using pop bottles.
21
78%
Yes, Replace with a pop bottle distance competition.
4
15%
Yes, Replace with a different competition (if you vote this choice please leave suggestions in this thread as to what the competition should involve).
1
4%
 
Total votes: 27
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Competition revisions

Postby WRA2 » Sun Dec 02, 2012 1:00 pm

It is winter time for most of us, so it is time to review the competition rules and classes. This year we will look at the "WRA2 Altitude Challenge" competition. Form the feedback, I have received, it appears main reason for the lack of participation in this competition is that that this competition is too similar to our other competitions. That said there will be a poll conducted to determine if changes are needed and to start a discussion as to what the changes should be (if any). The voting will be available to everyone (not just WRA2 members) to get good data on what the public would want for a new competition/class and this is posted here instead of the members only area. Final approvals of any modifications will be voted by members only.

For review, the WRA2 Altitude Challenge rules can be found at:
http://www.wra2.org/WRA2_Altitude_Challenge_Rules.php
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Re: Competition revisions

Postby U.S. Water Rockets1 » Sat Dec 08, 2012 11:48 pm

Altitude record using only ordinary bottles is interesting because there is a lot of people who have been going for height with rockets like this and now that they can build a deploy system for under $10 using the ServoChron(tm), this could really create an infusion of new designs into the sport.

On the other hand, a lot of schools have distance competitions, so there are a lot of young people who have been exposed to this type of contest, and they would be able to transfer their designs right into the new competition.

Either one of these sounds good for the sport.
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Re: Competition revisions

Postby The Mooseheads » Sun Dec 09, 2012 12:59 pm

I think having the contest be limited to regular bottles is the best idea. I just don't have the time anymore to work with complicated reinforcing techniques, and I bet there are a lot of others in the same pickle as me. A contest that will keep the time and budget low would be very appealing.
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Re: Competition revisions

Postby 1KorBust » Sun Dec 09, 2012 2:50 pm

U.S. Water Rockets1 wrote:Altitude record using only ordinary bottles is interesting because there is a lot of people who have been going for height with rockets like this and now that they can build a deploy system for under $10 using the ServoChron(tm), this could really create an infusion of new designs into the sport.


I have been out of the loop for a while what is a Servochron and who makes it?
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Re: Competition revisions

Postby NOAH6 » Mon Dec 10, 2012 2:44 am

It seems to me that WRA2 could use rules similar to race car races where they have different classes of cars. Stock, super stock, Formula One etc.
1) An unlimited class following the current rules.
2) Un-reinforced pop bottles with a different class for each size bottle, maybe with a upper pressure limit for safety and to even out cost factors.
3) Height & distance records for each of the above classes. I can see why schools use distance : it is easy to measure.
4) Minimum payload perhaps to prevent height records without parachute devices.
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Re: Competition revisions

Postby WRA2 » Mon Dec 10, 2012 5:31 pm

NOAH6 wrote:It seems to me that WRA2 could use rules similar to race car races where they have different classes of cars. Stock, super stock, Formula One etc.
1) An unlimited class following the current rules.
2) Un-reinforced pop bottles with a different class for each size bottle, maybe with a upper pressure limit for safety and to even out cost factors.
3) Height & distance records for each of the above classes. I can see why schools use distance : it is easy to measure.
4) Minimum payload perhaps to prevent height records without parachute devices.


Hi NOAH6

With the design of this new class, some of your suggestions might be adopted.

The only question to be answered would be how many people would be interested in the different classes.

Here are some answers to your points.

1 & 2. 2 sub classes could be created "reinforced" and "un-reinforced"
3. Distance is easier to measure at a live event, output from an altimeter is easier via the web.
4. Our rules currently prohibit a rocket without a recovery system (multiple flight rule and maximum speed at touchdown) Our competitions require multiple flights within a specified time period to be eligible for a record and our safety rules require a maximum speed at touchdown to qualify.

After the voting is closed we will start drafting the rules for the new competition and these suggestions will be investigated.
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Re: Competition revisions

Postby Spaceman Spiff » Tue Dec 11, 2012 12:42 pm

I would like to see a distance contest added but one thing that worries me is that people could go out on a day when a huge storm front is brewing and launch with the wind at their back to get a huge boost from a tailwind.
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Re: Competition revisions

Postby Brian » Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:19 pm

A distance competition would be good as it would keep new members happy but previous discussions didn't work out how to measure distance reliably. A competition restricted to the use of bottles would bring out some interesting designs.
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Re: Competition revisions

Postby addstogether » Wed Dec 19, 2012 8:26 pm

I think a combination of pop bottles and the rules as they stand. In this new class possibly add some consistency in having wra2 have available inexpensive certified altimeters and on board cameras to be used. This would make it even for the weight and cost associated with this class. It would then come down to design and launcher only. These could be posted to anywhere in the world at a minimal cost.
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Re: Competition revisions

Postby Spartan117 » Mon Dec 24, 2012 3:49 pm

addstogether wrote:I think a combination of pop bottles and the rules as they stand. In this new class possibly add some consistency in having wra2 have available inexpensive certified altimeters and on board cameras to be used. This would make it even for the weight and cost associated with this class. It would then come down to design and launcher only. These could be posted to anywhere in the world at a minimal cost.


I think sharing a certified altimeter is a cool idea. Would there be some kind of deposit or collateral involved to prevent people from stealing them or would there be a small rental fee to be used as an insurance policy that would grow over time to cover any damaged ones that might be involved in a crash or a CATO?
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Re: Competition revisions

Postby addstogether » Tue Jan 15, 2013 6:20 am

I was more thinking of wra2 creating/finding supplier to produce altimiters for use in rockets that meet the rule guidelines at minimal cost. Either that or testing various altimeters and certifing that they are ok under the rules. Your idea of leasing with a deposit / full payment I didn;t think of and is a good idea. Full payment refunded on safe return in working order would work.
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Re: Competition revisions

Postby WRA2 » Tue Jan 15, 2013 5:23 pm

addstogether wrote:I was more thinking of wra2 creating/finding supplier to produce altimiters for use in rockets that meet the rule guidelines at minimal cost. Either that or testing various altimeters and certifing that they are ok under the rules. Your idea of leasing with a deposit / full payment I didn;t think of and is a good idea. Full payment refunded on safe return in working order would work.


I did a little research into the idea that the WRA2 could loan or lease altimeters. It looks like it could not be done without having to charge membership dues unless there were teams that wished to donate altimeters. We really want to keep the association free and not charge dues (the cost of the website and the labor to maintain it are all donated). Even with donated altimeters, we would probably need to buy insurance against damage or theft (more likely damage) if the team was to put up a security deposit. (A team that could put up the cash for the security deposit most likely would be able to afford to buy their ow altimeter). Also finding an insurance company willing to insure a device that would be flown on a rocket could also prove difficult.

The suggestion of a list of approved altimeters does sound like a good idea. Would people like a dedicated thread on this forum to post altimeters, specifications, cost and where to buy. We could discuss them and make a list of WRA2 approved altimeters to publish on the WRA2 website. A "where to buy" might be useful as some altimeters are available only in certain geographical areas (taxes, shipping, import fees may affect cost and a locally available one may be more cost effective.

As an effort to keep altimeter cost down, the new "unreifoced bottle" class will allow the use of "peak" altimeters. There altimeter typically only record the highest altitude the rocket flies and usually cost about half what a "logging" altimeter does.

The WRA2 flight duration competition requires no altimeters and is a good choice for a team that cannot afford an altimeter at all
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Re: Competition revisions

Postby addstogether » Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:35 pm

Hi,

Has anything come of the approved list of altimeters and where to buy them?

Or did this not go anywhere?

Allan