Grab adhesive?

[Mat]

Along with it appears many others, I'm struggling to find suitable adhesives available in the UK with which to splice bottles. The best I seem to have come across in B&Q are Grab Adhesives, are these in any way similar to Construction Adhesives such as PL Premium?

Has anyone tried Evo-Stik Wet Grab? I have half a tube left over from a kitchen sink repair. It seems to stick to anything and remains quite rubbery so naïvely appears promising. I've made a quick test joint on a loop of scrap bottle, but have yet to shrink a bottle to try it with a proper splice. In the same section at B&Q was Evo-Grip which I might also try.

[danb]

Hi there mat i am from the uk and i use sikaflex EBT, sika flex 11 fc, you can get sikaflex EBT from Screwfix costs around £7 only use sikaflex for sealing the bottles together to make them strong enough to use for launching you will need to buy Gorilla Glue a PU adhesive. once the bottles have cured over night cut a 5cm strip of bottle material use the gorilla glue to stick this to the spliced ove r the join of the splice make sure all the joins when gluing both sikaflex and gorilla glue have been sanded use 1oo grit paper it works well for my splices.
heres a tutorial from the master George Katz from air command rockets http://www.aircommandrockets.com/construction_6.htm
hope this helps
Dan B

[Mat]

Cheers Dan.

Yeah, I was trying to follow George Katz's Asymmetric Splice #5; in fact I've had a play tonight prior to reading your post.

I've done the first stage of a couple of bottles, one with Wet Grab, the other with some Unibond No More Nail Super Strength. I had both lying around already open so thought it worth a try. I didn't really expect to get my first shrinkage and curling quite right so doubt it was too much wasted effort. I pick up some Sikaflex EBT from Screwfix for the next one. Is there much difference between EBT and 11FC?

The test Wet Grab piece I did last night separated easily from the PET bottle so I'm not hopeful with that and I expect the No More Nails won't flex enough. It sounds like I should finish these off with Gorilla Glue for the outer strip rather than more of the same. Gorilla Glue from Screwfix too? Is there only one type as prices on gorillaglueonline.co.uk seem all out of kilter for different quantities? How much Gorilla Glue will I get through?

I also had a go at making some of your bottle top couplings. They need drilling yet, and I imagine reinforcement of some kind.

[danb]

hey Mat i have not noticed any difference between Sikaflex EBT and 11FC my bottles have held fine up to 120 psi be careful with the bottle couplers as the last batch i made dont screw onto the bottles quite right we learnt the hard way with an explosion!!!!! dont melt them to much and test them before you go to use them in a flight .

Dan B

[Mat]

Hi again Dan. Sikaflex EBT seems to work well, so I'm about to try to put the sleeves on with Gorilla Glue. Do you use it neat or mix it 2:3 with Polyfilla akin to Air Command's VISE glue tests? Glue on one side, damp on the other?

I've just tried a small test piece before I ruin a nicely spliced bottle but it seems a bit thick with Polfilla. Will see how it comes out. Guess which idiot threw most of his scrap plastic out in the recycling this morning.

[danb]

Dont worry mat ive thrown many bottles away after rubbish results with glues and splices, with gorrilla glue i do mix polyfilla with it 2:3 ratio mix it in a yoghurt pot then let it sit for 10 to 15 mins as it hardens slightly and does not foam up so much it still has 100% sticking power apply glue to sleeve and splice then leave for 5 days hope this helps post up some finished pics.
dan b

[Mat]

I did a glue test a week or so ago, and took photos (which I don't seem to be able to embed "You cannot use certain BBCodes: [img]"?)

Conglomerate photo here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/matburnham/5966817998/in/photostream/lightbox/

[Mat]

And here and some of my bottles for critique

• First set of completed bottles - Sikaflex EBT, Wet Grab and No nails. The latter under pressure which wasn't entirely unsurpising. I've tested the Wet Grab to about 100psi but had some issues with the Gardena fitting so haven't tried the Sikaflex one yet.
• Sleeve glueing last night. Found that plastic 'zip' ties greatly assist holding the sleeve tight during initial glueing, though its important to remove them along with the tape before it has completely cured. I wonder whether they would assist in bottle strength at high pressures instead of strapping tape?
• On the way to curing sleeve

[Mat]

Oh, and I never actually replied to your post. A yoghurt (or at least plastic) pot works a lot better than the aluminium pie containers I was using so that was a nice tip. Weirdly, it seems to spread easier after leaving it a few minutes to harden first. I also now realise I've only been applying the glue to one side only - it was fiddly enough as it was. Seems to be okay as it still foams out top and bottom so must have good coverage.

Oh, and my last should read "The latter [No nails] leaks under pressure". Duh.

[danb]

very nice matt the splices are looking great keep up the good work
dan b

[WRA2]

I did a glue test a week or so ago, and took photos (which I don't seem to be able to embed "You cannot use certain BBCodes: [img]"?)

Conglomerate photo here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/matburnham/5966817998/in/photostream/lightbox/

Hi Mat,

The "IMG" tag is disabled board wide. If you wish to include an image, Please use the attachment function. When images are hosted elsewhere, they tend to "disappear" over time. Some time in the future, someone might want to see your image and if you delete the account or change hosting companies, the image will be gone and no one would be able to learn from it. That is why we encourage the use of the attachment function and have disabled the "IMG" tag. When an image is attached, it is be archived with the post.

Hop[e that helps,

[U.S. Water Rockets1]

I did a glue test a week or so ago, and took photos (which I don't seem to be able to embed "You cannot use certain BBCodes: [img]"?)

Conglomerate photo here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/matburnham/5966817998/in/photostream/lightbox/

Hi Mat,

The "IMG" tag is disabled board wide. If you wish to include an image, Please use the attachment function. When images are hosted elsewhere, they tend to "disappear" over time. Some time in the future, someone might want to see your image and if you delete the account or change hosting companies, the image will be gone and no one would be able to learn from it. That is why we encourage the use of the attachment function and have disabled the "IMG" tag. When an image is attached, it is be archived with the post.

Hop[e that helps,

Thanks for archiving everything here for posterity! Nothing is more frustrating than finding a site with information on it you want to see and having all the image or file links broken!

[poriet]

Hi,
I'm in the UK and I've never come across Sikkaflex or the other one (11?? ). The only adhesives mentioned were stuff I'd never heard of ( proprietry US brands, I guess ).
On a whim I tried a urethane type adhesive sold as wood-glue in 300 mL. tubes. From Screwfix, IIRC. It's hideous stuff: gets on everything and impossible to get off your hands. But it sticks to PET!

Bruce

[Spaceman Spiff]

Hi,
I'm in the UK and I've never come across Sikkaflex or the other one (11?? ). The only adhesives mentioned were stuff I'd never heard of ( proprietry US brands, I guess ).
On a whim I tried a urethane type adhesive sold as wood-glue in 300 mL. tubes. From Screwfix, IIRC. It's hideous stuff: gets on everything and impossible to get off your hands. But it sticks to PET!

Bruce

PL Premium is the same way. If you get it on anything you have ruined it! If you get it on your hands you will have it there until the skin comes off!

[U.S. Water Rockets1]

Hi,
I'm in the UK and I've never come across Sikkaflex or the other one (11?? ). The only adhesives mentioned were stuff I'd never heard of ( proprietry US brands, I guess ).
On a whim I tried a urethane type adhesive sold as wood-glue in 300 mL. tubes. From Screwfix, IIRC. It's hideous stuff: gets on everything and impossible to get off your hands. But it sticks to PET!

Bruce

PL Premium is the same way. If you get it on anything you have ruined it! If you get it on your hands you will have it there until the skin comes off!

If you get some mineral spirits and a rag you can take PL off anything as long as you get it quickly. Just have it ready before you start your project and you will be fine.