Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Discussion about deployment systems including altimeters, timers, air speed flaps, servo systems, and chemical reactions.
tcarnahan
WRA2 Member
WRA2 Member
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2010 9:37 pm

Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by tcarnahan »

I recently bought a Mini DV D005 camera from Deal Extreme http://www.dealextreme.com/p/mini-2-0-m ... slot-34157.

For the price, it is a fairly decent digital camcorder. The only complaint I would have is that it came by (literally) a "slow boat from China" and its instructions are hard to follow ... but I digress.

My question is how to mount it on my payload?

It measures : 2.48 in x 1.22 in x 0.87 in (6.3 cm x 3.1 cm x 2.2 cm) and weighs: 6.17 oz (175 g). Its lens is 90 degrees to the camera body. It has a voice actuated mode so one could turn it on, set the mode, then slide it into the payload and launch. It takes a microSD card (I am using a 4gb card).

My concerns:
  • How to get the head outside the payload without drag problems
  • How to quickly secure it so that it doesn't come loose during acceleration
If anyone can suggest a way to meet these requirements or can show me a link to someone who already has this one solved, I would appreciate it. Note: most of the sites I have seen, the photos are so far away or at an angle that you cannot tell how they mounted the camera.

Thanks ahead of time for your help!

-- Tom
Picture of D005 (Left side)
Picture of D005 (Left side)
Camera_001.jpg (75.38 KiB) Viewed 130 times
Camera (Right side)
Camera (Right side)
Camera_002.jpg (66.3 KiB) Viewed 130 times
Camera (back side)
Camera (back side)
Camera_003.jpg (71.29 KiB) Viewed 130 times
tcarnahan
WRA2 Member
WRA2 Member
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2010 9:37 pm

Re: Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by tcarnahan »

By the way, if you are interested in watching a review of this camera, go to:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWEdGHOJusI
User avatar
U.S. Water Rockets1
WRA2 Member
WRA2 Member
Posts: 1778
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 3:24 pm

Re: Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by U.S. Water Rockets1 »

tcarnahan wrote:I recently bought a Mini DV D005 camera from Deal Extreme http://www.dealextreme.com/p/mini-2-0-m ... slot-34157.

For the price, it is a fairly decent digital camcorder. The only complaint I would have is that it came by (literally) a "slow boat from China" and its instructions are hard to follow ... but I digress.

My question is how to mount it on my payload?

It measures : 2.48 in x 1.22 in x 0.87 in (6.3 cm x 3.1 cm x 2.2 cm) and weighs: 6.17 oz (175 g). Its lens is 90 degrees to the camera body. It has a voice actuated mode so one could turn it on, set the mode, then slide it into the payload and launch. It takes a microSD card (I am using a 4gb card).

My concerns:
  • How to get the head outside the payload without drag problems
  • How to quickly secure it so that it doesn't come loose during acceleration
If anyone can suggest a way to meet these requirements or can show me a link to someone who already has this one solved, I would appreciate it. Note: most of the sites I have seen, the photos are so far away or at an angle that you cannot tell how they mounted the camera.

Thanks ahead of time for your help!

-- Tom
The attachment Camera_001.jpg is no longer available
The attachment Camera_002.jpg is no longer available
The attachment Camera_003.jpg is no longer available
Hi Tom,

We're not familiar with that exact model camera. It resembles the MiniDV MD-80 camera that is widely used.

Does your camera suffer from the same problem with the (timesatamp that cannot be turned of)f as the MD-80 clone cameras have? We had an extensive discussion about those cameras in this topic: http://www.wra2.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=971 and you should check it out to see if you have a new variant of that design. It would be nice to know if that camera has the same innards as the others because we have a tutorial series on our YouTube Channel (http://www.youtube.com/uswaterrockets) describing our method for removing the date overlay from the videos.

To answer your questions, the absolute best way to mount the camera would be to place it inside the rocket and not on the outside. The way you do this is pretty much up to you, but a nice way to do this is to cut a "window" in the side of your nosecone and epoxy a small piece of glass (you can get microscope specimen slides for this) over the inside of the hole to seal it off.

The camera doesn't have any good way to mount it so your next job is to epoxy some "mounting ears" to the sides of the camera. Some small wooden blocks or plastic scraps can be glued to the sides of the camera. You then drill holes through the ears so you can attach it to the inside of the nosecone looking out the "window". Some people use "hook and loop" / "velcro" to hold the camera on the inside of the nosecone wall but our rockets use ultra high pressures and we don't want to risk the camera coming loose on launch.

One thing you can do if you are using a barometric altimeter on your rocket is to place the camera behind the "breather" hole for the altimeter and use the breather hole for the camera to look out of. This eliminates the need to construct a window and uses an existing hole for multiple purposes, which is more efficient. We have sample videos on YouTube showing what this looks like from inside the rocket.

Pinhole Camera viewing out through altimeter air hole.
Pinhole Camera viewing out through altimeter air hole.
pinhole.jpg (110.23 KiB) Viewed 20 times
If you want to look "down" at the ground during the flight, you either have to attach the camera to the outside of the rocket looking down, or you need to glue a small mirror at a 45 degree angle in front of the "window". Take apart a cheap dental mirror you can buy at the drugstore for the mirror glass.

If you have any questions, feel free to ask!

Please post your videos after you launch. We'd love to see them!
Team U.S. Water Rockets
Visit USWaterRockets.com
Visit our Blog
Tune in to our YouTube Channel
Visit our Facebook page
Visit our Twitter Page
Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work. --Thomas Edison
tcarnahan
WRA2 Member
WRA2 Member
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2010 9:37 pm

Re: Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by tcarnahan »

Many thanks for the recommendations! I will have to try out the mirror idea.
User avatar
Spaceman Spiff
WRA2 Member
WRA2 Member
Posts: 681
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 11:06 am

Re: Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by Spaceman Spiff »

tcarnahan wrote:I recently bought a Mini DV D005 camera from Deal Extreme http://www.dealextreme.com/p/mini-2-0-m ... slot-34157.

For the price, it is a fairly decent digital camcorder. The only complaint I would have is that it came by (literally) a "slow boat from China" and its instructions are hard to follow ... but I digress.

My question is how to mount it on my payload?

It measures : 2.48 in x 1.22 in x 0.87 in (6.3 cm x 3.1 cm x 2.2 cm) and weighs: 6.17 oz (175 g). Its lens is 90 degrees to the camera body. It has a voice actuated mode so one could turn it on, set the mode, then slide it into the payload and launch. It takes a microSD card (I am using a 4gb card).

My concerns:
  • How to get the head outside the payload without drag problems
  • How to quickly secure it so that it doesn't come loose during acceleration
If anyone can suggest a way to meet these requirements or can show me a link to someone who already has this one solved, I would appreciate it. Note: most of the sites I have seen, the photos are so far away or at an angle that you cannot tell how they mounted the camera.

Thanks ahead of time for your help!

-- Tom
Howdy Tom!

Allow me to plug my own little invention to you: what I do is I simply tape the camera to the cap that screw onto the top bottle of my rocket. The nose bottle fits over the top of the rocket and I cut a hole in from of the camera so it can see out. I trled just looking out a clear bottle but it distorts the view too badly so I added the hole later on.

I like this way because I can just unscrew the cap and it stays with the camera and I can bring it inside and download the videos really easily. The other nice thing is that I can activate the camera and put the nose on really fast so I don't waste a lot of flash memory or battery once the camera is started.
Camera on board
Camera on board
md80.jpg (1.15 MiB) Viewed 115 times
Nose with window
Nose with window
window.jpg (1.06 MiB) Viewed 115 times
Assembled Rocket
Assembled Rocket
rocket.jpg (1.12 MiB) Viewed 115 times
I also have the idea where I tape the camera to the tornado coupling between my stages and cover it with a cylinder of bottle with the window cut in it. It keeps it away from the from of the rocket so it is better if it crashes. I always disliked tornod coupled rockets because of the wasted weight but my recent builds have one segment at the front and I put all of the electronics and parachute inside the narrows where the tornado tube is. I have never seen anyone do this before and I think it is the best way.
Spaceman Spiff
"What goes up, must come down"
User avatar
WRA2
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 1089
Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 11:30 pm

Re: Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by WRA2 »

Spaceman Spiff wrote: I always disliked tornod coupled rockets because of the wasted weight but my recent builds have one segment at the front and I put all of the electronics and parachute inside the narrows where the tornado tube is. I have never seen anyone do this before and I think it is the best way.
Tornado & Robinson coupled rockets are favorites for beginners because of their simplicity to construct despite the added weight. But the idea of using the space between the connections as a payload bay to house your camera and altimeter would work and would be allowed under the rules. Just remember that the altitude recorded for record purposes is the altitude that the altimeter reaches and not to the tip of the nose. PH:
Lisa Walker,
:WRA2: Forum Administrator. :WRA2:
:WRA2:The Water Rocket Achievement World Record Association :WRA2:
tcarnahan
WRA2 Member
WRA2 Member
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2010 9:37 pm

Re: Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by tcarnahan »

Thanks for the Ideas, Spaceman and Lisa ... good food for thought! I appreciate it!
User avatar
U.S. Water Rockets1
WRA2 Member
WRA2 Member
Posts: 1778
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 3:24 pm

Re: Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by U.S. Water Rockets1 »

Spaceman: That is a really good idea. We tried a similar concept back when we were first going for the record. We used an extension on our nozzle creating a narrow area on the bottom of the rocket to mount our camera and altimeter because we had been losing a lot of equipment due to crashes. The idea worked well and protected the electronics from crashes, but it added weight and we eventually abandoned the idea by switching to a dual parachute rocket system. We abandoned that after we had a camera float away.
Team U.S. Water Rockets
Visit USWaterRockets.com
Visit our Blog
Tune in to our YouTube Channel
Visit our Facebook page
Visit our Twitter Page
Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work. --Thomas Edison
tcarnahan
WRA2 Member
WRA2 Member
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2010 9:37 pm

Re: Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by tcarnahan »

I noticed in the review of the camera, the CCD (camera head) is attached by a ribbon cable and mounted on sponge rubber. I am a little reluctant to dissect my camera until I have had the chance to launch it a few times, but, has anyone tried to separate the head and position it outside the rocket in a "looking down" position? Any problems with asymetrical drag?

I had considered the slanted mirror approach but am not sure that I can mount it properly and get it to provide 100% of the view.

Any suggestions? Any blogs or videos that discuss this?

Thanks!
User avatar
U.S. Water Rockets1
WRA2 Member
WRA2 Member
Posts: 1778
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 3:24 pm

Re: Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by U.S. Water Rockets1 »

tcarnahan wrote:I noticed in the review of the camera, the CCD (camera head) is attached by a ribbon cable and mounted on sponge rubber. I am a little reluctant to dissect my camera until I have had the chance to launch it a few times, but, has anyone tried to separate the head and position it outside the rocket in a "looking down" position? Any problems with asymetrical drag?

I had considered the slanted mirror approach but am not sure that I can mount it properly and get it to provide 100% of the view.

Any suggestions? Any blogs or videos that discuss this?

Thanks!
The flexible cable would allow you to position the optical sensor and lens outside the body of the rocket but the optical sensor on the outside of the rocket is pretty exposed and can get knocked off. We had the parachute line snag on one and tear it off completely. It was also harder to build for us because the camera would need to be placed inside the rocket permanently and could never be removed. The labor involved in building the camera was pretty high compared to just gluing a mirror on the outside of the rocket.

The trick with the mirror to get the full view is to get it as close to the lens as you can. The viewing cone of the camera is very small near the lens and a very small mirror can cover the whole field. The viewing cone expands as you get farther from the lens. The best way is to place the lens right next to the rocket side and the mirror right over it.
Team U.S. Water Rockets
Visit USWaterRockets.com
Visit our Blog
Tune in to our YouTube Channel
Visit our Facebook page
Visit our Twitter Page
Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work. --Thomas Edison
air.command
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 183
Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2008 5:20 am

Re: Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by air.command »

tcarnahan wrote:I noticed in the review of the camera, the CCD (camera head) is attached by a ribbon cable and mounted on sponge rubber. I am a little reluctant to dissect my camera until I have had the chance to launch it a few times, but, has anyone tried to separate the head and position it outside the rocket in a "looking down" position? Any problems with asymetrical drag?

I had considered the slanted mirror approach but am not sure that I can mount it properly and get it to provide 100% of the view.

Any suggestions? Any blogs or videos that discuss this?

Thanks!
Hi Tom, I would suggest keeping the camera in one piece as it helps protect it, and makes it easier to move between rockets. To mount the mirror we use a thin strip of aluminium about 1cm wide and 3cm long. The strip is bent at 45 degrees about 1cm from the end, Like this ____/ We just tape the longer section to the fairing above the camera, and use double sided tape to attach the small mirror to the bent section. You can easily adjust the mirror angle to get the view you want. As was mentioned you just need a small mirror. Our mirror is about 1cm square and is positioned so the bottom edge is about 1mm from the lens. With the mirror attached to the rocket, you can remove the camera for downloading the video or put it in another rocket.

I wouldn't worry too much about asymmetrical drag, as most rockets end up spinning somewhat so the rocket ends up flying a very slight spiral vertically rather than flying over in an arc.

- George
http://www.AirCommandRockets.com
tcarnahan
WRA2 Member
WRA2 Member
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2010 9:37 pm

Re: Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by tcarnahan »

I appreciate the input from both Team U.S. Water Rockets and George at
Air Command Rockets. You both have been very helpful ... I wasn't looking forward to dissecting the camera!

I am curious how both of you address the problem of mounting the camera so that it is easily removable from the rocket (e.g. to start the video before launch or to download the video file), yet keep it secure enough that the G-forces don't knock it out of alignment with the mirror.

Can you point me to any examples?

George, I know you probably have an example on your site, but there is so much info, I probably missed it.

Thanks ahead of time for any assistance you can provide!
air.command
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 183
Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2008 5:20 am

Re: Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by air.command »

tcarnahan wrote: Can you point me to any examples?

George, I know you probably have an example on your site, but there is so much info, I probably missed it.
We normally make a small box from cardboard that is recessed into the fairing between bottles, and line it with a thin (5mm) layer of foam. This is not so much to cushion it from impact but rather acts as a nice grip for the camera.
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_3qKR ... 0604_s.jpg

We start the camera recording and put it in it's place and then put a piece of tape over it.
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_3qKR ... 0605_s.jpg
This is the config we use when we want a sideways view.

Here it is with the tape holding it in place and the mirror as described above.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_3qKR ... 0612_s.jpg

After the rocket lands you just remove the tape and take the camera out. This way there is no need to add extra access holes for buttons, LEDs or USB connectors. We've flown the camera with this setup in over 100 flights and have never had an issue with the camera coming out midflight.

- George
http://www.AirCommandRockets.com
tcarnahan
WRA2 Member
WRA2 Member
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2010 9:37 pm

Re: Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by tcarnahan »

Thanks George! ... that was exactly what I needed to jump-start my brain. Very ingenious use of the void between bottles.

By the way, did I see a tornado tube being used as a coupling in your picture? Maybe I am mistaken.

I know you guys try to plan for high pressures. I didn't think tornado tube couplings would handle high pressure.

Thanks again for the ideas!
air.command
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 183
Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2008 5:20 am

Re: Mounting a Mini DV D005 Camera

Post by air.command »

tcarnahan wrote:By the way, did I see a tornado tube being used as a coupling in your picture? Maybe I am mistaken.
Yes, that is a tornado coupling. These ones give the full 22mm opening.
tcarnahan wrote:I know you guys try to plan for high pressures. I didn't think tornado tube couplings would handle high pressure.
That depends on the type of tornado tubes you are using. The ones above we make from polypropylene and are very tough. They will handle 300psi without problems. On a recent crash the bottle necks screwed inside them smashed and completely broke away from the rest of the bottles, but the couplings were fine. It took a bit of work to unscrew the neck remnants from inside the couplings.

Last year we pressure tested the commercial tornado tubes that are made from a more brittle plastic and they were still holding 270psi. Though they would probably crack when subjected to a very hard landing.

Here it is undergoing pressure tests to 270psi.
http://www.aircommandrockets.com/images ... 2_04_s.jpg
http://www.AirCommandRockets.com